Helga Jakobson: A "Zero Waste" Forks and the Right to a Healthy Environment

When we picture zero waste, we often think of recycling bins or reusable coffee cups. But Helga Jakobson sees something bigger: behind every piece of waste is a human story — someone who made it, someone who handles it, and communities who live with its impact.

As Sustainability Coordinator at The Forks, Helga is turning one of Winnipeg's most beloved gathering places into a living example of how community spaces can practice real sustainability. From her background as a transdisciplinary new media artist to her current work transforming coffee grounds into de-icer, Helga brings creativity and data together to communicate what's happening with our planet in ways people can actually understand and act on.

We're talking:

• Why protecting the earth and protecting people are the same conversation

• How The Forks operates in a circular economy instead of the "produce, consume, throw away" linear model

• Why setting "zero" as a goal matters even if you don't quite reach it

Helga reminds us that sustainability work doesn't require perfection or pushback. Sometimes the most innovative solutions come from conversations with tenants over coffee, listening to Indigenous voices and water protectors, and staying hopeful even when the news feels overwhelming.

As she puts it: "Everyone has the ability to create impact around them. So speak up."

Learn more about the Forks' "Target Zero" project.

More on Helga:

Helga Jakobson is the Sustainability Coordinator at the Forks and is a Transdisciplinary Artist. In 2017, she received an MFA from AKV St. Joost (The Netherlands) in conjunction with courses in the Transdisciplinary New Media program at the Paris College of Art (France). She has exhibited, lectured and participated in residencies across North and South America and Europe. She was selected for the Emerging Excellence Award by the Manitoba Arts Council in 2019, has mentored through Creative Manitoba, Video Pool and, currently, MAWA. She lectures on material ecologies, eco-feminism, and sustainability in art. Her art practice often focuses on how to live on a damaged earth and how to make tangible the almost invisible and inaudible losses that are occurring all around us, from an environmental perspective.

As CEO of a bourgeoning recycling business (REDO Waste), a Butterflyway Ranger for the David Suzuki Foundation and former Executive Director of ArtsJunktion (a creative reuse depot), Helga brings to her role as Sustainability Coordinator wide spanning experiences that help her to promote sustainability, with waste diversion and composting at the Forks.

When she’s off duty, she can be found hiking and camping, gardening and cuddling her foster fail dogs; Wednesday and Huginn.

Episode Transcript: Stuart Murray 0:00

This podcast was recorded on the ancestral lands, on treaty one territory, the traditional territory of the Anishinaabe Cree, Oji Cree, Dakota and the Dene peoples, and on the homeland of the Metis nation.

Helga Jakobson 0:20

This is humans on rights, a podcast advocating for the education of human rights. Here's your host, Stuart Murray,

Stuart Murray 0:31

when we hear the phrase zero waste, zero waste, we often picture recycling bins or reusable coffee cups, but behind every piece of waste, there's a human story, someone who made it, someone who handles it, and communities who live with its impact. Zero Waste isn't just about cleaning up our planet. It's about fairness, dignity and the right for every person to live in a safe, healthy environment, because protecting the earth and protecting people are really the same conversation. So on this episode of humans on rights, I'm joined by Helga Jakobson, sustainability coordinator at the forks, and many other things, by the way, but this is what we're talking about today. Sustainability Coordinator at the forks, a place that's becoming a living example of how community spaces can take sustainability from an idea to everyday action. So Helga Jacobsen, welcome to humans on rights.

Helga Jakobson 1:30

Thanks so much for having me. I'm thrilled to be here. So Helga,

Stuart Murray 1:33

you have a tremendous resume, and I just didn't want to sort of spend the whole thing reading it. But certainly it'll be on our notes on this episode, but perhaps just introduce yourself to the listeners and tell us a little bit about what you're doing about zero waste at the forks.

Helga Jakobson 1:49

Please. Absolutely. So. Helga Jakobson, she, her pronouns. I'm the Sustainability Coordinator here at the forks, but I'm primarily an artist. I studied in transdisciplinary new media. And the reason that I I kind of laid that as the background, is that my art practice has informed all of my actions and led me into being an environmentalist in my own right. My my background in new media means that I'm a bit of a data fan, and which leads right into zero waste and into into the sustainability world. It's really important to think through your human scale impact as an individual, and then also looking at the wider context and globally, locally, and looking at what's what's happening all around you, and finding a way of synthesizing that information has led me into a deep passion for communicating to people what's going on, and in a way that's understandable, because it's we're in a big mess. And you know, the forks is such a lovely place to work, because I often say this when I go to a conference or when I'm in a training session, I'll hear a lot of complaints about lack of innovation from from the their CEOs or from the boards of directors that people are working for. And I have none of that. I live a pretty lucky life. I I know that everyone on the staff at the forks here and and the majority of the people who visit are all very sustainably minded. All of our tenants are a dream to work with. I don't have one person on on any front that that I find any pushback from. It's a really lovely environment, and I feel very lucky, yeah.

Stuart Murray 3:36

And I, you know, without, you know, sort of making trying to spotlight on your CEO, Sarah stasiak, who I know, well, who was responsible for this intro, by the way, yeah, yeah. She runs, runs a wonderful operation there. And so let's, let's dive into it. I mean, one of the things about zero waste Helga, when you think about it, it sounds like it's a, you know, like a pipe dream, right? I mean, you have to have a dream in order to sort of get to where you're going. But you know, just before we get into the specifics of what you're doing, just you touched a little bit on the fact that, you know, there's some big issues out there. So you know, for those that are listening to this podcast, why is sort of zero waste, or that sustainability issue, from a human rights perspective, so important now, and why would you say it's important to the people of Winnipeg?

Unknown Speaker 4:24

I mean, how long do we have? No, just

Stuart Murray 4:27

kidding, for sure. No, no, all good is your podcast.

Helga Jakobson 4:31

We know from from the Paris accord that that global warming is is an incredible issue. The lofty goals put forward that seemed attainable at the time are not being met. That 1.5 degrees Celsius just is. We're not there when we're looking statistically at over consumption, when we're looking statistically at at the environmental impact that that over consumption has, whether it's through. Waste Reduction lenses, or whether you're looking at resource extraction or over usage, we can see that, you know, there are very clearly divides in who is and is not participating in good ways on this earth. And yeah, so, I mean, we're moving closer and closer to midnight on the global doomsday clock. We have our Earth Overshoot Day is coming fast at March 26 this year from the over consumption lens and and, yeah, it's time for real change where we're running out of the resources that we need to be able to function in the way that we are when we look at over consumption, Manitoba specifically is rated as the third worst province in Canada, or actually the second worst province recently, and and we're Canada's number three on the global scale. So we we are the problem for over consumption, and so making active and tangible steps are critical on on a global scale. When when you look at the coral reefs dying out, and the impact that that has, where we see all of these natural disasters like wildfire season being a given here in Manitoba specifically, but you also look at hurricane Melissa hitting Jamaica right now. You look at all of these actions, like war actions that are happening around the world, and knowing the global impact that those human rights violations have, it's devastating. And so you know to root it back from a net zero standpoint. It is a lofty goal. It's it's maybe unreachable to hit zero globally and for individuals as well, but it's really important, and the closer that we get to that target, the better we know this net zero, Target Zero, our phrase is Target Zero. You know, these, these are all actions that are one step at a time and bit by bit, kind of eating the elephant, so to speak. But that and the roadmap to getting there looks different for for different people in different places, in government, in corporations, on an individual scale, and all of these small actions add up. The way that I look at Target Zero or net zero or zero, waste that lofty realm that I work in and and live in. I think about the power of imagination. So I come at all of these actions as an artist. And you know, when, when you look there, I went to a really lovely talk one time by an afro futurist author named itasha Womack. And she said, and she was hearkening to Ursula Kay Le Guin, who's an incredible science fiction author and individual in her own right. And you know, it hasha was bringing forward, if you cannot imagine a better world, there is not going to be a better world to live in. And the power of imagination and and setting zero as a goal is critical, because then, if you don't quite hit that zero, you've come so much further right. And so in in the sustainability world, you know, it's it's really important to reframe and reimagine how we're functioning. So at at the forks we operate in the realms of circular economy, and looking at our actions from a different perspective than the linear economy that we've become accustomed to, which linear economy being, you know, you produce, you consume, you throw away and start again. So kind of keeping things in that one line where circular economy is thinking about how to keep things in action, and the material aspects of circularity, of okay, how can we make sure that we're not wasting and that comes into almost every level at the forks, which is just so awesome, yeah, and

Stuart Murray 9:11

we're going to explore that, because there was a great article just recently about coffee grounds, and I want to get into that, because I'm a huge coffee drinker. But so so Helga, just help me a little bit. You said something about overconsumption date. I think you talk about March is coming, what? Just explain what that is for those people that don't know

Helga Jakobson 9:29

that's the overshot date. So looking at overshooting, it's looking at the goals that your country, that your province, that you know globally, we've set so things like the Paris accord and and looking at if, per year, what's the point at which you've overshot your goals and you're not going to meet it? Ours is

Stuart Murray 9:51

march on the March, from what the calendar year though the calendar

Helga Jakobson 9:56

year, yeah, from January's date. So, so it just means to say that. The goals that we're presenting forward are are not reachable and, and so, you know, how can we act more quickly? These, these dates and on those kind of information can feel really overwhelming, but it can also just speak to, you know, not operating as business as usual. And, and think really thinking about how, on an individual or corporate scale, or provincial scale, etc, we can act differently and use that as a motivator to move faster towards our goals, right?

Stuart Murray 10:31

So then Helga just, you know, looking at and again, by the way, I would just sort of give a big shout out to whoever does the website for the forks. It's really fabulous. And lots of great information there. And the fact that on the website template, one of the headings is Target Zero, it just again, speaks to how important this initiative is for you and the whole forks team, just to play a little bit of devil's advocate for a second. Okay, so say, for example, and I've just used numbers of this for the conversation. So say that you've realized that at the forks you have somewhere in the neighborhood, and you've been able to measure that there's a 10% waste in what you do, in your circular economy, and how you do it. If you set a goal of saying, You know what, we're going to cut that in half. We're going to go to 5% and work hard at that and see where you go. I The only reason I'm saying it, Helga, is I love your notion. If you if you imagine, and you dream big, and you say, we're going to zero, and you say, are at 10, and you get to five, or you get to six, you get to four, you're moving in the right direction. I mean, you can't look at that as anything other than positive. You can't sort of say, well, we didn't hit zero. What we our goal is, is to reduce it, and we're marching towards that goal. I just think, for those people that are listening, because I know a lot of times Helga, you talk about the Paris accord, and governments meet, and you know, they have this huge manifesto that they all agree to, and it's a big number. And the reality is, is that at some point it just becomes a number. It's not something that is realistic. And you know, people can pat themselves on the back and they can use it in a speech and applaud, or get applause from the audience with the hopes. But you know, where do we sort of come full circle to sort of say, Here's we are talking about Target Zero. We're passionate about it. You talk about zero garbage, zero water waste and zero carbon emissions. Yeah. So, you know what I love about it is you're trying to put it out there so it's all measurable. And you know the old adage, you can only manage what you can measure. So, so how are you looking at measuring some of these incredible targets that you have aggressively set for the forks,

Helga Jakobson 12:42

yeah, well, first I'll say where I'm so lucky. You're right. Like the website design is beautiful. We have an incredible communications team and an external relations team, and everyone on staff is on board the way that the forks approaches our Target Zero initiatives is to to situate ourselves where the two greens meet, where we're two rivers meet. So we're used to that meeting point. This is a historic meeting point of over 6000 years. We're setting our goals in line with generational approaches, so looking at the seven generations, for instance, and trying to do right on that scale. So I say that because the first, the first point of action for us, comes from doing right by by the Earth. But we do it where the two greens meet, so where it's fiscally responsible as well as environmentally friendly. There's not an exact 5050, split between those two. Some actions are going to be more costly, but the inherent value is clearly there, and sometimes it's going to be a lot more unfeasible to manage certain activities that we would love to so we just can't do them. So so first of all, the matrix that we set is, is kind of framing through that framework, yeah. And then the way that we measure depends on the thing that we're doing. So we're, for instance, where the two greens meet. We realized that it was astronomically expensive to heat and cool an historic building like a market space that that wasn't intended to be a food hall, for instance, and so we installed a $2.2 million geothermal heating system is a huge bill up front, but we've paid for it above and beyond with the savings that it's that it's given us, so where we kind of that was a really great landmark, kind of beacon for us of Wow, okay, environmentally friendly activities can actually save you a lot of money, and so that kind of set in motion. A lot of actions on site we've we of course, look at at the things that are the highest priorities and have the highest impact, and try to tackle those first so things like diesel fuel and carbon emissions, we've. Transformed our ice resurfacer or Zamboni. You can't call it a Zamboni, because it's not Zamboni brand ice resurfacer.

Stuart Murray 15:07

Very good. Well done. Yeah, totally Yeah, for sure.

Helga Jakobson 15:11

So that, as well as the kubotas on our site, all run on recycled french fry grease. So we take the grease that normally would be a waste material, and I run it through a centrifuge and a filtration process on site that turns it into a biofuel. So that comes with a great cost savings, as well as being a great earth friendly activity, it's a tangible way of lowering emissions. And then from a circular economy standpoint, looking at, can we walk in between spaces? If you can't walk, then can you use these kubotas Before anything else, and kind of going from there. So, so tackling the larger problem first is really critical. Looking at emissions caused by food waste, we set up our own composting facility, which isn't as good of a return on investment as geothermal, but intrinsically it has such a great value, and it's it's absolutely a critical activity on this earth, so that's what we do, and we do save a lot of money because we're not hauling usable material off site to a landfill, where it will not decompose appropriately and will produce more greenhouse gas.

Stuart Murray 16:28

I just think a lot of people talk about composting, you know, in their own homes, locally. And part of you know, what I think is admirable, of what you're doing is, you know, you're kind of giving examples, real examples, in I mean, just a reminder to anybody who's listening who hasn't been to the forks, I can't imagine people that are listening haven't been to the forks. You have over 4 million visitors a year, right? But I'm just saying, when you look at the goals that you're trying to do with that volume of people, you know, you kind of step back and say, how hard could it be for a family of four, right? In a house? So you're trying to sort of look at that. But composting is something that a lot of people talk about, talk walk us through the composting process. We'd love that you do with the forks and what do you do with the the residue when you're able to sort of once it's fully composted?

Helga Jakobson 17:16

On an individual scale, I'll maybe speak to the bigger picture first, wishes that we really, absolutely it's critical that we get municipal composting. We should have green bin pickups. It's, it's a bit, it's a bit embarrassing that we don't have that for for people, because not everyone has a backyard, not everybody has the knowledge base or the time to be able to do that personal composting. And so places like compost Winnipeg are absolutely wonderful. They they provide a service like that. So people, if you don't have composting at home, and you're one of the people listening, you could sign up for compost Winnipeg. They're really lovely. And composting is is an absolutely critical activity for for moving towards net zero for us, we have the facility to not only manage food waste so pre and post consumer materials that that are able to be composted, but we also can compost packaging which would not be appropriate in a home setting, so using bio plastics and Things like that are mandated at the forks, so all of the takeout containers that you see on our site go go through my approval and, and they are compostable in our facilities. So not only are we taking the food scraps and, and you know, off cuts from prep, food preparation, but we're also taking the packaging, so we're really minimizing our waste in an incredible way. We just this year alone, in comparison to 2024 in 2025 we've produced 40 tons less waste going to the landfill, and a major portion of that is because of our composting activities and our recycling programs and programs and education, because we don't have those municipal supports in individual composting, our public doesn't know how to compost appropriately. So what we've done is we've set up a sorting station where you bring your tray and you drop it off, add that station and our trained team make sure that any excess is going into our composting facility. So we we have a machine on site called a biovader, which you put in all of the food waste and and packaging that is compostable in with a ratio of carbon material, so wood chips that are produced on site when we have to cut down trees or or anything like that, the leaf litter that that happens. And we combine the two and then output compost. We we run it through our procedures, so we turn the compost and make sure that it's gone. Through the prfp, which is the process to reduce further pathogens, which is how we're legislated to be able to run this facility, because we produce 500 metric tons of compost per year. And so with that material, we then screen it out, and we create a fine compost as well as a mulch compost. So the mulch compost goes on to our orchard and into a lot of our flower beds, some of our native species flower beds, as well as anything on site. And then we top dress all of the turf. So if you've ever enjoyed an outdoor concert, or you've come to the pride parade or or any of those wonderful outdoor activities that we have on at the forks you've been on grass that has been supported through you eating french fries. So it's a full we run a full circle loop. It's, it's

Stuart Murray 20:56

really lovely. Yeah, that's incredible. And, I mean, those numbers are huge. But again, I come back to, you know, the notion that you have 4 million visitors and, you know, I mean, the whole process, I think of getting to, you know, Target Zero, you know, it's such an education. Helga, you know, I mean, I would say the one thing that, as somebody who goes to the forks a fair bit, and I love it down there like so I'm, I'm the three, 3,000,999/9 person, right? In addition that goes there is, you know, you do have adequate places for waste. You do have adequate places for those people that have finished, you know, with their food or whatever that may be. And you know, the team that you have that comes around and does the cleaning and does the sorting and stuff again, you know, kind of those unnamed heroes, right? Like, amazing work that they do, and they make sure that happens, because he'll get just kind of full disclosure, I got to tell you, sometimes when I'm sitting there with See, I've had a burger and it's in it's in a container, and I've had a coffee and it's in a container, and I've got my utensil and my my napkin, and I'm ready to sort of put it in. And I got, it's almost like I got three choices here. There's three little holes. You got to figure out where you're going to put it. And, you know, sometimes, you know, in fairness, I look at it and go, Oh my goodness, I'm okay. I think this is the right spot for this. But you know, to me again, I, you know, I'll just be the first one to say, you know, I could be a bit more educated to make the right decision. But a lot of people who are just sort of saying, well, somebody else will look after it, just kind of put it in. How do you deal with with people like me?

Helga Jakobson 22:32

Oh, well, I love dealing with people like you. Not only are you lovely, Stuart, but also it's not your fault. The the issue is a lack of education from a systemic level, but it's also that every system is different, so you need localized solutions to localized problems. What is, quote, unquote, recyclable is not necessarily accepted in every facility in every province, in every city, etc, and and without that information sharing from those in positions of power and those those men managing those facilities, then you're not empowered to know. And so for us, the way that we deal with it is we have almost no garbages on our site and in the interior space at least. And what we do is we have people going around to support you, because we know that everyone it's it's true right across the board, the majority of people want to do right, but we're overwhelmed, we're tired, we're taxed, we're overworked, and we don't know. And so for us, what we've done is we've implemented a new trace system, so it's similar to an Ikea style facility, where you can just drop off your tray, drop off your garbage, drop off your recycling that you think might be garbage or you don't really know, and we'll deal with it because we have a team who are paid of nice wage to be able to manage that, and who are trained so our our idea is we don't Want to be shaming. We don't want to be negatively enforcing that somebody is incorrect, because that doesn't lead to more informed, a more empowered population. It just leads to people who will then hide their trash, you know, or take it home and throw it out, or, or what have you. And, and so yeah, so we really take that, that supportive approach to being able to allow people to do right like you can't, not every facility. In fact, most facilities don't have composting in in mattiti but there are more and more, thanks to compost Winnipeg, but people don't have those options, and so we're not expecting that everybody knows how to do that here, we just want to provide them the opportunity to know and rest easy that if they're wanting to make an environmentally friendly dining experience for themselves, they can do it at the forks. You know, right?

Stuart Murray 24:55

Perfect. Yeah. No, no. I love that. I love that. Helga. So listen a little bit of a. Pivot sidebar. So compost Winnipeg, if you reach out to them and I will, what will they do for you? I know this isn't part of what you do at the forks, by the way. This is kind of a sidebar, but it's all in the bigger picture of even everything, right? So what would

Helga Jakobson 25:15

they do? What they would do is they you can either pay for a service to have a bin at your house that they'll pick up weekly or or someone, they'll figure out a schedule with you. Again, I don't work for them, but I'm really happy to share, because it's all for this greater good, of course, and we collaborate with them. They're they're lovely individuals and an organization, but so you can do that, or you can go on their map, and there are a number of drop off locations where you can simply take your compost to for free. So if cost is a barrier, we're here talking about human rights. Everyone should have the right to to be able to do well with their waste and and so finances aren't shouldn't be a barrier. So there are free drop off spots at a number of locations around the city, so you can transport it yourself, or you can pay for a private service to compost with them. And then they also do training sessions. You can take courses in learning how to do it yourself in your own backyard, if you're that kind of a person. But there should be all of those different options, because they're this amount, the amount of waste in Manitoba, is astronomical, and being able to appropriately divert is one of the highest impacts that you can have our number one and two, you know, greenhouse gas and carbon emitting practices Are transportation number one, and then number two is landfill, well and agriculture. So as an individual, that's one of the best things that you can do, is compost. Those those materials are so great and useful for the Earth. Being able to create compost, it's, it's just magical. So I'm, yeah, so I'm thrilled being able to provide that support at the forks here and and also to preach the goodness of it, and to know that we have compost Winnipeg doing that incredible work and supporting individuals.

Stuart Murray 27:11

Thanks for sharing. I mean, it's really good, important information. So thanks for that. Helga. Appreciate it. Let's go back to chatting a little bit about sort of you talked about, sort of on your your website, zero. Target Zero. You talked about zero garbage, which I think you've talked a little bit about. I want to sort of explore a little bit about zero water waste. How do you what? Just talk a little bit about what? How do you come to recognizing that there's a waste in water, and then how do you make it zero?

Helga Jakobson 27:36

That one's a little bit further off on the list, our focus is, is, first and foremost, the waste diversion, because it has the higher impact and the carbon emissions. So the zero water waste, we have low flow flush toilets, where we're making sure that we're doing regular monitoring through our our water bills, etc, making sure that there are no leaks. So we're preemptively monitoring and and we're constantly sourcing other opportunities. So, so looking at low flow valves and and things like that, although, again, that's not our highest activity. Our highest are those two major impacts of of waste diversion and and carbon

Stuart Murray 28:21

emissions, okay? And so the carbon emission really comes down to the biofuel process that you're involved in, yeah,

Helga Jakobson 28:27

and also supporting individuals in active transport. So we have bike lanes, dedicated bike lanes. We have cyclist counters. We're watching how people are coming into the forks and exiting the forks, and we're trying to support them actively. We have a number of bus routes. We also have installed EV charging stations and and, yeah, so we're one of that's one other way that we're supporting lower carbon emission and also reducing the amount of hauls from our site, and figuring out how to manage waste on site, so that we don't need to send things away. So that comes back to the circular economy, where it's looking at procurement models, so being clever about how you're purchasing and managing the materials you already own and have on site. So we often do, like a very recent one, is is we have a number of boards that that we're getting taken down from from a parking area, and we store those and make sure that we're able to use those materials in existence before ever purchasing more. And all of that includes less trips to and from the store for hauling materials away to landfill sites or recycling facilities, and so that ties into our waste diversion as well. With that reduction in 40 metric tons in a year, that means that equates to at least four less trips to the landfill, which comes with an incredible cost for carbon emissions. If we're if we add everything all together. So, so just being clever about material management is a really important part of stewardship.

Stuart Murray 30:08

One of the things you touched on at the beginning Helga was geothermal. And, you know, again, one of the things I'd just be interested in, maybe you don't have this, which is fair, because you're not an accountant. You're doing a lot of other things, but, but the point I would just ask is that, you know, a lot of people would say to say, Okay, here's the deal. We put $2.2 million into the ground, and people 2.2 million. Where do we get that from? Then you start to say, okay, but here's how this plays out. And so the 2.2 million is offsetting what we would normally have to pay, you know, whether it's hydro or whatever it may be to sort of heat this, and so over the course of time, as you say, it kind of pays for itself. Just a curious question, and I understand if you might not have this, but do you know how long it took to get the 2.2 million sort of paid out?

Helga Jakobson 30:55

My understanding is that it was under 10 years. Wow. I'm not sure the exact number and, and all of the intricacies involved. But it's not that long. And, and, I mean, that's at the forks, right? It. Can you imagine if new builds were required to to, you know, put in the geothermal? It would be incredible. And just to bring it back to the point of human rights, you know, we, we oftentimes think about hydro power, which is our predominant power source, as being an incredibly environmentally friendly energy source. But it's it's not. It comes with a high cost to biodiversity. You know, there are a lot of First Nations people who are negatively impacted by the dams that that are in their communities. And so it's really nice to be able to work in a place knowing that it's, it's powered from the earth and from the river right next to us. It's, it feels a lot nicer.

Stuart Murray 31:55

Yeah, no, it's, and I kind of love how you kind of, you know, put that all as part of the narrative held Helga. Because I do think that, you know, the the forks is a very, very special place and has done amazing work, and a lot of it is just, you know, on the basis that, as from a, just say, from a tourist or a commercial entity. And you know, it's a great place to be when you start to bake in these whole issues about sustainability. And, you know, there you and I love the fact you keep coming back to the reference on human rights, because this is a podcast on human rights for those people Helga that would just sort of say, Oh, come on. You know what you're really talking about is, you know, just putting in some sustainability, you know, doing some composting. And, yeah, it sounds great, and the numbers are great. But you know, really, let's, let's bring it home to a human right perspective. And I'd love for you to sort of share that, because I I know from your background, from being an artist, and how you look at, sort of the human perspective, bringing what you know. And I can tell you that when I asked Sarah stasiak about sustainability, she said, I can't exactly use all the words here. It's just kind of a family podcast, but she was like, Oh my God, you know, you got somebody that you ought to meet, Helga Jakobson. So, you know, you have a lot of passion for this Helga, and you have a lot of expertise. Tie it in from a perspective of working in an area where the forks a very, very public community space, where there's a lot of moving parts, restaurants, activities, and yet, you know, let's market it as a Human Rights Initiative.

Helga Jakobson 33:28

Yeah, absolutely. Well, that's so nice to hear. Sarah's an incredible leader. She's so exceptional. What she's done at the forks has been out of this world. And I'm just so thankful to work here and and specifically, get to work with her. She's wonderful, yeah. From, from my perspective, one of the reasons that I decided to take this job was because of the impact that it has. 4 million people is, is not something to scoff at. That's a huge impact. And, and a lot of tourists, a lot of people who are coming here for the first time. Or, you know, we're lucky to be on treaty one territory. This is the heart of Turtle Island, the forks being this historic meeting point for, you know, 1000s and 1000s of years, this land feels very special and very important. It's so lovely to be able to watch how those 4 million people engage on the site, looking at everything from the winter, you know, being a Manitoban yourself, you know, it can be really challenging in those cold months, and to have the skating trail, this epic skating trail with art on it, with these warming huts that are just so interesting and of an international caliber. It's it's humanizing. It feels really wonderful, and you don't have to spend a penny to come and enjoy it. And one of the things that's so absolutely critically important here is that this space is still a free meeting space, and it will be. Me for generations to come. It's harder and harder living in a world where finances get tighter and tighter, watching, you know, the Doom out in the world, and having somewhere right in the heart of your city to be able to come to you don't have to feel the stress and strain of finances as a barrier. You can come and gather food for free at our orchard, for instance, you can come bring your own lunch and and no one is going to bat an eye or make you feel uncomfortable for just enjoying your own food or your own space. You know, getting to watch people engage in activities like free crafting nights, free ping pong tournaments, things like that. And and just knowing that it's it's generating this good and healthy environment all while we have these closed circles, like our composting activities, being able to use what's on the site, having land that we're stewarding in a way that's that's supportive of not only the humans getting to enjoy the beauty of these gardens, but planting native species, which are drought tolerant, which are good for The native pollinators, and watching the birds coming in. It's, it's really what, what the forks does is follows through on the health and well being of the full environment and the full ecosystem of not only Winnipeg and Manitoba, but but of anybody who's actively enjoying the space and and I mean, that's, that's human rights. We have the right to a healthy environment. We have the right to be able to live a good life and and I really feel as though the forks does such an exceptional job at it. It's so nice to be a piece of that puzzle. And again, like thinking about sustainability, not just from a material management perspective, but also from a food justice perspective, you know, from equitable access, it's pretty exceptional.

Stuart Murray 37:11

Yeah, no, it is. And I and thank you for kind of putting a bow around that, because there's a whole lot of of, you know, kind of human rights elements that are tied into this. And I think, you know, one of the things that we try to do, at least on this podcast, this is all about, sort of, how do you sort of get people to, sort of educate people, then to get them to sort of give a sense of taking action, you know, sort of, here's what you can do. And I think hopefully what you've demonstrated in numerous ways through this conversation Helga, is that, you know, if you can do something in a, in a in a, in an entity as large a footprint as the forks, how do you do it in your home? And how can you do it in an apartment? And so there's all these opportunities I think we can, we can get to, I wanted to just get you to talk a little bit, if you will, about the path, the cycling path that you have got from Osborne village into st Boniface into the forks. And I want to do that on the basis that, having just come from Amsterdam, where there's a tremendous number of cyclists there, and I know it's an ongoing issue with cycling in Winnipeg, as we start to engage more bike lanes. You see more people on bikes. How is that something that you see yourself playing a huge role, and not Helga Jakobson, but you and your role as sustainability coordinator for the forks. How do you see advocating for that, educating people on the importance of how that also can be a big impact on what you're targeting, which is Target Zero for the forks.

Helga Jakobson 38:46

Well, I mean, and again, to bring it back to this human rights perspective, we have the right to be able to engage in transportation to and from the spaces that we need to get to, like our job, from our home the grocery store, from our home to a friend's house, etc, we have the right to be able to do that without needing to pay. It's active transport is absolutely critical from an intersectional standpoint. You know, not everyone has the finances to be able to afford bussing. Not everyone has the ability to afford a car, and they should have the ability to get to and from where they need to be. First and foremost, never mind, you should be able to do that separated from cars so that you're not breathing in exhaust fumes, which are terrible for your physical health, and also those exhaust fumes are the number one issue in our net zero pathway to sustainability. There, the amount of carbon emissions that come from cars is astronomical, and in Manitoba, we. Don't have enough adequate active transport supports in place. And so you know, having at the forks, being able to keep separated bike lanes, having pathways that folks can cycle through, the prairie gardens along the river, spaces that are completely separated from cars, feels like such a gift to the city and and it's something that we will continually provide supports with. We have bike racks. We have a lot of resources, like the wrench, where you can come and use this as a pit stop to repair your bike where, yeah, it feels like a really lovely site for for a number of reasons, and an active transport is a really big part of it. You can also rent a bike here. And even in the winter, Kendricks has winter bikes, so you can try out what that feels like on a fat tire bike. So it's, you know, that's, yeah, that it doesn't fully route to something tangible, necessarily, or a bigger action, but, but that's part of the importance. And we want to be a bike friendly space,

Stuart Murray 41:10

okay, for sure. And I have a couple of a couple of quick hits for you before, before I get into the coffee ground piece, I want to go there. But just, you know, so Helga, obviously, you've done some tremendous, tremendous work with your team there. Obviously, would love to just sort of share some of your your maybe one of your biggest challenges and maybe one of your biggest successes.

Helga Jakobson 41:32

One of the biggest successes is our waste diversion. Watching 40 metric tons. I just keep saying that number because I'm I'm still shocked by it and and enlivened and and thankful because all of that. That sort of number only comes with multiple people feeling empowered, educated and supported to make better decisions around waste management. That's I'm I love talking trash, pardon my tongue, and so, so that's that's probably my, my biggest feeling of triumph

Stuart Murray 42:07

here, just to visualize for a sec, 40 tons. Like it's a massive number, huge. What is the equivalent of 40 tons? Do you have a visual that you could sort of throw out to people are listening? Is it?

Helga Jakobson 42:19

It would depend on the elephant, but it would be about 1010, to 15 elephants. It's It's massive. When you look at, I'm not sure how familiar the average person is with the look of a garbage compactor, but it's four, four garbage compactors full, so 440 yard bins. It's huge. It feels like a real win.

Stuart Murray 42:46

That is huge for I mean, and that's, you know, I I love the visual, because a lot of people, 40 sounds like 40s. Well, it's one more than 39 and tons. There's, I don't know what a ton is, but like a elephant, like, that's so thank you for that visualization. I think that's super helpful and something to be super proud of for sure. What about? What about a challenge?

Helga Jakobson 43:04

The biggest challenge is lack of facilities that accept materials locally that are not necessarily commingled in the recycling realm. There aren't there are no processing plants that I'm aware of locally. We, are only limited to managing the materials that come into our site and and there are certain kinds of plastics. There are certain kinds of, yeah, materials that just simply are not accepted at the the MRF, like the local recycling facility, and that's frustrating. What we've done to combat that is we have a single use plastics ban. So we we're minimizing constantly the materials that are coming in on site, and working one on one, specifically with our food tenants, that's where a large portion of single use waste comes from. We're constantly trying to problem solve, but it's a real frustration there. There is a manufacturer ban that was put in place for single use plastics federally, that just launched in September. And it's, frankly, too little too late. It's, I mean, we always need to continue on that, that movement. And as Donna Haraway, one of my, my great loves, says, the game's not over, not yet. Any action is a good action, but it's frustrating. So, so I think that's my, my biggest, my biggest complaint is, is the lack of recycling facilities

Stuart Murray 44:32

in the you know? I mean, the reason you're there is to sort of deal with these issues, right? I mean, that's your expertise. So, yeah, I appreciate you sharing that. I and I just a couple of things that jump to mind is that, when I went through, you know, you talked about, sort of, if people want to look at something or get some visuals, you mentioned documentaries, the story of plastics, just coming back to what you mentioned on plastic. And then, of course, our short one, yeah, our planet, David Attenborough, who, you know, I mean, the guy could talk about how to make paint, and he's just so interesting. Is. Voice is so incredible, so, but Helga, you know, where is, I mean, has there been any discussion, you know, about making a documentary about the work that you're doing at the forks to Target Zero?

Helga Jakobson 45:12

Not that I'm aware of, but, but I know the forks is always thrilled to share any information. So, I mean, yeah, I'm sure we would be very happy to do that if someone was interested, but also if any individual or company or group is looking for resources. We love sharing. So part of being an innovator means we don't want people to have to start from zero. We want to share so that they can start at, you know, the fifth rung on the ladder and, and cut out some of, some of that learning curve, right? We, we've had to go through it and, and it's, it's challenging. So, so anyone is so welcome to reach out, whether it's for a documentary or whether it's just for a little tip or trick where we're happy to share,

Stuart Murray 45:58

yeah, I ask it out, not, not in any way tongue in cheek. I ask it seriously, because I do think you know that you the work you're doing, you needs to be captured. It needs to be shared. And as you say, you're so open and what you've shared already. And talk about compost Winnipeg, you know that is just, you know, sort of a wonderful, you know, act of kindness, which I think you know we need to have more in this world. So that's a whole other issue, but, but thank you for that. And and so, Helga, you know, I did start almost the podcast off with this question. We're going to kind of as the hourglass kind of comes to an end here, but talk about turning coffee grinds into grit. Talk a little bit about that. I love that article, but share with with the listeners the process. I'd love

Helga Jakobson 46:40

to, yeah, so, so we, we realized that, you know, we, we don't work with salts at all. For de icing, Manitoba, especially as climate crisis worsens, we are going to find more and more extreme weather events and weather circumstances and and, yeah, ice is a real problem, as we know from an accessibility standpoint, again, to root it back to human rights, and it's also just a challenge to deal with in an environmentally responsible way. Working with salts is terrible for the environment, and so we use grit, so we only use pebbles. And my role, I feel so lucky to have my role. My role is a lot of working with people and talking to people and and thinking through problems. And one of our lovely tenants, from Fools and Horses, Ben Gillies, who's the owner, was talking to me about, just about sustainability in general, and the work that they're doing which, which is incredible. They've they've adopted and exceeded all of our expectations around sustainability. He said, hey, you know, actually, you'll be interested in this. I've been taking home some of our coffee grinds that we usually compost at the forks and and I brought them to my mom's to test out on her pathway leading up to her house. And it works as a de ICER. Did you know that? And I said, Oh, no, I didn't. So I said, Oh, well, why don't we try it out here? It would be really interesting to see, and it was wonderful. It's a very effective de ICER. It melts the ice. So it's not just grit, but it's but it de ices. It's completely biodegradable. It it's completely Yeah, dissolves away over time. It smells lovely. It's effective. It's free. It's like, it's Check, check, check,

Stuart Murray 48:30

Yeah, no kidding, wow. So, so you don't mix the concrete grounds with anything Helga. You just, you just toss it. Wow. Okay, that is that. That is big, checkbox, yeah, yeah. No kidding, yeah, yeah, exactly. So, you know, I mean, again, what a great business. It would be for somebody to go around and collect all of this and then repackage it, right? So anyway, that's a business you and I will start on the side.

Helga Jakobson 48:55

100% Yeah, I'm in. We'll talk later about that totally okay.

Stuart Murray 49:00

Hey, hey, Helga, what a great conversation. Thank you so much. You know, I said at the outset, before we went online live, just to talk about, you know, you've got such a great background and and what you do, and as you talk about, sort of being an artist, first, I, you know, I love that, because it really brings your creativity to how you interpret these things and say, I can see how you've, you know, really used your background in a in a way that has advanced, something that some people would look at and sort of say, well, you're just recycling cops, right? Like, that's all it is. And it's like, yeah, it could be, but that's also exciting, and it's in its own way. So Helga, thank you for this. And I usually just always say to my podcast guests, obviously, thank you so much for being on but, you know, it's a big question, I guess, but I would like to just sort of ask you, is there something that you were hoping in this podcast about sustainability and human rights that I might ask you that I haven't asked you,

Helga Jakobson 49:55

not necessarily, but thank you for for asking it. Now, I think, for. Me, a really important piece is learning how to listen better. I think that, you know, it's we're in some pretty big messes when it comes to sustainability and and specifically, listening to indigenous voices is absolutely critical. A lot of the constructs that we have in systems that we have in place our colonial, you know, systems, and so it's, it's really important. Looking at water protectors, looking, looking at the folks who are experiencing and understand the land that we're on is absolutely critical. And so they're, you know, I think, I think that that's from a human rights perspective. I think that's a lesson right across the board is, is just listening to to indigenous voices, something that that I can share. You know, from my perspective, one of the biggest issues that we're facing in Manitoba is water quality. Maybe, like the the water source says that we have are greatly polluted and greatly affected by our activities. And that's that's definitely something that that is constantly on my mind, how to do better, and from an individual standpoint, speak to your representatives. That's one of the best things that you can do is, is voice your opinions to to your local councilors. They're they're there to advocate and amplify your voice. So, so be vocal. You look at what happened with the LeMay forest here in Manitoba, and the the incredible advocacy of individuals you you know everyone has the ability to create impact around them. And so speak up. And yeah, I think stay hopeful, because it's it feels really overpowering, especially with with news that comes in that's not pleasant all of the time, and and if you have a business that's one of the greatest voices that are listened to. I just went on a great bus tour yesterday on sustainability, from climate for biz or biz for climate. Pardon me, wrong way around biz for climate and and, you know, corporations like the Forex does great work internally. Every business can do that, and every business has the right to to speak up for the their their clientele and their visitors.

Stuart Murray 52:18

Helga, thank you so much. You know, it's sort of one of those things that I was trying to end by saying, Keep listening, keep questioning, keep taking a stand for human rights. So Helga Jakobson, the sustainability coordinator at the forks, thank you so much for taking some time to be humans on rights on this podcast. I really appreciate your time.

Helga Jakobson 52:35

Thank you so much for having me, and thanks for doing this great work.

Matt Cundill 52:39

Thanks for listening to humans on rights. A transcript of this episode is available by clicking the link in the show notes of this episode. Humans on rights is recorded and hosted by Stuart Murray, social media marketing by Buffy Davey, music by Doug Edmond. For more, go to human rights hub.ca produced and distributed by the sound off media company.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai